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Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
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Ted S.
Contributor
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 7:58 am Posts: 146 Location: Silver Spring, MD
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Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
Hello fellow Stickists,
I've recently started to work on recording my Stick and think I need a noise gate on the way in. I know there is bleed between the two sides of the pickups (PASV4), and using a single amp, or two amps, I never really noticed it and it didn't really bother me. However, I noticed it immediately when setting levels in my DAW. I almost thought that there was a wiring malfunction somewhere and the two channels were crossed (or summed to mono), but that was not the case.
What's your experience with noise gates and the Stick? Have they worked for you? Pros/Cons?
In addition to eliminating pickup bleed, I'm looking to remove the *clunk* of a misplaced finger striking adjacent strings as well. Would a noise gate help with that, or a larger mute (i.e. FretWrap) at the bridge?
I'm a fan of Pigtronix pedals, has anyone tried their noise gate? Any other recommendations? Would I be better off with a gate in the box, rather than an external unit?
Thanks in advance!
_________________ #6051 Wenge SG12, PASV-4, MR (2012) #5484 Padauk 12 String Grand Stick, PASV-4 MR (2008) #5727 Osage Orange 10 String Stick, PASV-4 MR (2008)
- Ted
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Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:50 pm |
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Jayesskerr
Elite Contributor
Joined: Sun May 18, 2014 9:43 am Posts: 4039
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
The boss noise suppressor is pretty good, I use them in my guitar rig as well as one enabled in my Boss GT-100 signal chain for the Stick (I use one GT-100 on the bass side, and one for the melody side). I really notice stuff when I record direct to my DAW, but maybe that's because of my interface (Apogee Ensemble into a Mac Pro). Little noises and hum, some crosstalk that I can sort of tolerate when I am plugged into my amps but I don't like it "Direct in" - Logic ProX's noise suppressor works great, as does Izotope's RX6 plugin... Being plugged into the Boss units for direct recording is pretty quiet also. I also have a Helix and an AxeFX that work great for that sort of thing too... (I prefer that for guitar, and the boss cosm stuff for Stick) As for the clanks and thwack noises, I try to practice those away... could be a while though!
_________________ GUITAR RULES https://www.facebook.com/scottsguitarstuffMy FB Page
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Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:55 pm |
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Skydiver
Site Donor
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:20 pm Posts: 817 Location: Dayton, OH
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
I use noise gates because I use high gain effects which just amplify hiss and when I'm not playing it's annoying... Gates aren't too good for the clunks and misplaced finger... just need to practice to get rid of that.
Since I use the MOD Duo, everything is "in the box" as it were... just like a DAW plugin. I did find that an expander sounds more natural. I find that the attack from the first note can be lost especially if the threshold is too high and the attack is too slow.
Another thing that can help is to use a high pass filter to cut out any low rumble that may bleed through to the melody side. Not sure if there is a pedal that does that...
_________________ Dean Kobayashi NS/Stick - Prototype #2 Started 11/24/2012
http://www.GreenElephantStudio.com Now Selling - MOD DUO, Tech21, Ebtech, KMI, Earasers, IsoAcoustics
Subscribe to the NS/Stick YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/NSSTICK
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Mon Jul 02, 2018 5:20 pm |
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sagehalo
Artisan Contributor
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:38 pm Posts: 681 Location: Cary, NC
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
Dean, which plug-in do you use for this application on the Mod Duo?
_________________ Daniel Marks #6133 Rosewood Grand, PASV4
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Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:36 am |
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Robstafarian
Site Donor
Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 12:55 pm Posts: 2486 Location: Virginia, USA
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
It sounds like you are describing a job for a high-pass filter, not a noise gate. In your DAW, add a high-pass filter to your melody side's track; set it to the fundamental frequency of your melody side's lowest string.
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Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:29 am |
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Skydiver
Site Donor
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:20 pm Posts: 817 Location: Dayton, OH
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
sagehalo wrote: Dean, which plug-in do you use for this application on the Mod Duo? For the Expanger/Gate I use the Mono Dynamics plugin. Select the expander option. There is a gate option too but I find it not as natural sounding as the expander. https://pedalboards.moddevices.com/plugins/aHR0cDovL21vZGRldmljZXMuY29tL3BsdWdpbnMvdGFwL2R5bmFtaWNzI use the High Pass Filter plugin to cut any low rumble. https://pedalboards.moddevices.com/plugins/aHR0cDovL21vZGRldmljZXMuY29tL3BsdWdpbnMvdGFwL2R5bmFtaWNzI'm a big fan of using High Pass Filters to just cut out any frequencies which are not useful. Those low-end frequencies which are inaudible can take away from your speakers and amplifier and lose clarity. I use the highpass filter even on the bass side set to 20 or 30hz to make sure those unusable frequencies don't get through. It may be overkill but it makes me feel good to know nothing desctructive is getting through...
_________________ Dean Kobayashi NS/Stick - Prototype #2 Started 11/24/2012
http://www.GreenElephantStudio.com Now Selling - MOD DUO, Tech21, Ebtech, KMI, Earasers, IsoAcoustics
Subscribe to the NS/Stick YouTube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/NSSTICK
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Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:00 am |
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greg
Multiple Donor
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:07 pm Posts: 7088 Location: Charlottesville, Virginia, USA
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
Robstafarian wrote: It sounds like you are describing a job for a high-pass filter, not a noise gate. In your DAW, add a high-pass filter to your melody side's track; set it to the fundamental frequency of your melody side's lowest string. For the PASV-4, this is a great recommendation, as most of the crosstalk is low-frequency on that pickup. Generally speaking, though, I would also suggest on working on technique to get more sound out of the strings you want to amplify. Hand movement = more energy in = less invasive crosstalk from the other set of strings. For more on how hand movement in Stick playing works, see my DVD, Basic Free Hands Technique
_________________ Happy tapping, greg Schedule an online Stick lesson
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Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:01 am |
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Per Boysen
Elite Contributor
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:05 am Posts: 2268 Location: Stockholm/Sweden
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
I agree with Robstafarian that a low cut (high pass) is more urgent than noise gates. I ALWAYS cut low frequencies from the melody side output before amplifying the signal. That's needed to get my lead tone, especially when using distortion on the melody side. Doing that cut in the DAW is too late, because keeping the low bumps from bass side and finger tapping in general out of the melody side system helps to make the tone sing better in the first place - and that is what is being recorded into the DAW, you want to record the best sounding output from both sides.
_________________ Cheers / Per Bamboo SG12, Wenge SG12, Bamboo Grand. PASV4 on all. (+ Stickup modded by Emmett 4 the PASV4 blocks). Fractal Audio AxeFx-III, 2 x RCF NX-10 SMA, Apollo Twin USB http://youtube.com/perboysen
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Tue Jul 03, 2018 1:33 pm |
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Robstafarian
Site Donor
Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 12:55 pm Posts: 2486 Location: Virginia, USA
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
Per Boysen wrote: I agree with Robstafarian that a low cut (high pass) is more urgent than noise gates. I ALWAYS cut low frequencies from the melody side output before amplifying the signal. That's needed to get my lead tone, especially when using distortion on the melody side. Doing that cut in the DAW is too late, because keeping the low bumps from bass side and finger tapping in general out of the melody side system helps to make the tone sing better in the first place - and that is what is being recorded into the DAW, you want to record the best sounding output from both sides. I got that the impression that the OP was running directly into a DAW. By the way, it is great to see you.
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Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:03 am |
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pcgonzales
Resident Contributor
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:09 am Posts: 395 Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Re: Noise Gates and the Stick: Recommendations?
If you do need to go noise gate route, I've owned an ISP decimator (an awesome pedal) , EHX Silencer and Joyo noise gate. If you want to experiment the Joyo price makes it painless and its pretty impressive. I think if money is no issue go ISP.
Just by 2cents.
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Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:20 pm |
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