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 Ghost MIDI pickup 
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
dcben wrote:
...
The "Ghost" approach keeps most everything inside, but it costs more.
...


This assuming that there is an inside ;) I don't think there is not much volume in a Stick to route a control cavity without compromising the stability of the instrument. Well at least I wouldn't dare to start taking out wood to realize that the remaining material start cracking under the tension :|


Daniel.


Mon Nov 16, 2009 5:05 pm
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
What I was looking for was a having hex pickups to use with my VG and V-bass units and my GI 20's. Using Piezo pickups would allow this as well as that 'piezo' sound if I wanted it.

As for putting the 'warts' on the back of the Stick - my 10 string Teak had that with two GK systems. It wasn't very friendly to work with. I've been playing around with some designs for some boxes that would wrap around the back and side of the Stick...electronic guts would be behind but the controls would be on the side where they could be reached.

However, I'm getting a lot of satisfaction playing the Stick without them so if/when I get the chance I'll do something. For now if I want to add something to the sound I use Guitar Rig. Of course processing 6 (or 12) individual signals/strings thru that would be a blast.... :)

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Wed Nov 18, 2009 3:26 pm
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
DaveS wrote:
I've been looking to modify the 12string Sticks I have. I had a 10 with dual SE GK pickups...was quite fun to play!

Using the piezo style pickup would mean it would have to go on the bridge - the string must pass over the element so the vibrations get transferred to the piezo element. (you could theoretically put it anywhere on the bridge to pickup vibrations but your isolation would not be nearly good enough for driving a hex or double-hex system).

If I decide to go forward with this (piezo pickup) I will have to make custom saddles - perhaps even a bridge. Still waiting on word back from LR Baggs.



Have you pursued this any further, and had any success with it?

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Wed Sep 29, 2010 9:21 pm
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
I actually took the MIDI p/u from my Purpleheart Grand and mounted it to the Paduak Grand. Been enjoying it a lot so I just started looking into this project again. I'm waiting for some info from a Piezo pickup manufacturer as well as exploring some alternate pickup mounting ideas. I really would like to have just the one 'ledge' cut to hold the pickup as it (the ledge) exists now. I was thinking of just buying another GK system from Stick but it could not be mounted the way they normally are - I would have to route the cable the same direction as the melody side GK cable goes which means swapping a few of the connector pins around. It's a possibility though - and then I could just concentrate on making a better control housing...

When I come up with something I'll post it here.

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Thu Sep 30, 2010 8:01 am
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
DaveS wrote:
I actually took the MIDI p/u from my Purpleheart Grand and mounted it to the Paduak Grand. Been enjoying it a lot so I just started looking into this project again. I'm waiting for some info from a Piezo pickup manufacturer as well as exploring some alternate pickup mounting ideas. I really would like to have just the one 'ledge' cut to hold the pickup as it (the ledge) exists now. I was thinking of just buying another GK system from Stick but it could not be mounted the way they normally are - I would have to route the cable the same direction as the melody side GK cable goes which means swapping a few of the connector pins around. It's a possibility though - and then I could just concentrate on making a better control housing...

When I come up with something I'll post it here.


I had contacted Graphtech about this, and they said they didn't have any Ghost pickups that would fit the Stick's bridge as it is, unless I removed the bridge and replaced it with one of theirs - no thanks.

I did have an idea on how we might be able to use the Graphtech Hexpander and/or Acoustiphonic systems. The only thing missing is individual piezo pickups for each string. I just sent an email to Graphtech to see if they could make one that fits into the saddle screw slot (replacing the stock SE saddle screw with a piezo loaded one).

If we could get the individual piezo pickup per string issue sorted out, here's how I think we could implement the Graphtech Hexpander and/or Acoustiphonic systems:

excerpt from an email I sent them
Quote:
First, I would have a small channel routed underneath the bridge to route the piezo wires. Once the string height is properly set, the screws no longer need adjustment at any point, so I would make sure that the instrument is properly set up before connecting the wires to anything.

Second, I would need to mount and wire all of the Hexpander/Acoustiphonic hardware in an external enclosure which would be mounted to the side of the Stick (below the pickup housing near the tail - which is where the Roland GK pickup box is mounted on a Stick). Included in the project box would be a 1/4" TRS jack to accept the signal out of the Stick's pickup (as the pickup is in it's own self contained enclosure) in order to make the proper connections for the Hexpander/Acoustiphonic.

Third, for Acoustiphonic implementation of all 10 strings, I would follow the recommendation on your site that is listed for 8 string guitar, and use a second summing board. For the Hexpander I would only use it for 5 (or 6) of the strings (the 'melody' side of the Stick).

Piezo pickup issue aside, does this sound feasible?


Some relevant info from their site:
Quote:
Can the Hexpander be installed in an eight string (8 string) guitar?

Currently, the Hexpander and most (all?) MIDI converters are limited to six strings. There are two popular workarounds for an 8-string guitar:

1) have two of everything: two Hexpanders, two MIDI controllers, two cords coming from your guitar, and split the systems 4 + 4 strings, or 2 + 6 strings. Expensive, and a bit cumbersome.

2) Install the Hexpander and the Acousti-phonic and have six strings on MIDI, and two on piezo-only. Depending on the music you\'re playing, it may work to have the two bass strings as straight acoustic, and the rest as MIDI.

The Acousti-Phonic, on the other hand, is ready to go for seven strings or more. At eight strings, you have to add a second summing board, which is a small, inexpensive part. The main board can go to ten, twelve, or more strings.
http://www.graphtech.com/kbase.html?ArticleID=10

Quote:
Can the ghost system be used with other manufacturer's components?

Yes, many piezo technologies are similar enough that they will interface successfully. Often the biggest difficulty is getting parts from different manufacturers physically hooked up together. Other companies don't use the nifty plug-in connectors like the ghost system, so you're in for some stripping and soldering.

An inexpensive way to interface another manufacturer's piezo bridge with the ghost system is to order the Extension Harness and solder wires from the bridge to the pins on the harness. That way the other manufacture's bridge will plug in to the ghost system.

BE-0511-00 ghost Extension Wiring Harness
http://www.graphtech.com/kbase.html?ArticleID=13

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Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:54 am
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
That's good information. I've been pretty busy with some other on-going projects but hope to jump back into this soon. I was actually thinking of making new saddle pieces for the Stick bridge that the piezo elements could fit into. All depends on the particualr piezo element dimensions.

Ah so many projects, so little time....

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Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:07 am
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
DaveS wrote:
That's good information. I've been pretty busy with some other on-going projects but hope to jump back into this soon. I was actually thinking of making new saddle pieces for the Stick bridge that the piezo elements could fit into. All depends on the particualr piezo element dimensions.


latest email from GraphTech:

Quote:
Those saddles are nothing like anything we make. But it occurred to me that the way to go might be to get a set of metal saddles machined that will accommodate our ABM pickups:

http://www.graphtech.com/product-63-2/

Check the size on these, to see if they fit within your string spacing. You’ll still have height adjustment with the two sets screws.

These saddles are used in similar applications like Hipshot’s Triple Lock Down individual bridges:

http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.p ... tail&p=223

For machining the metal saddles, I recommend you contact Jon Bondy. He’s done a lot of work over the years putting piezo saddles into Steinberger bridges, so he’s capable of taking this on. http://jonbondy.com/

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Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:48 am
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
I'm following this with much interest.

I would definitely need height adjustment at the bridge if the saddles can be replaced.

From the last reply, have you been able to figure out if the ABM will fit the stick bridge?


Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:27 pm
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
Panther wrote:
I'm following this with much interest.

I would definitely need height adjustment at the bridge if the saddles can be replaced.

From the last reply, have you been able to figure out if the ABM will fit the stick bridge?


Hi Panther, and anyone else who may be watching this subject.

I didn't get around to sending an email to Mr. Bondy until today. So I'm waiting to hear back from him.

Contacted LR Baggs, Graph Tech, and RMC - none of them will do a custom job.

I posted a thread in the DIY section of the Harmony Central forums, and someone directed me to this site http://windworld.com/products-page/electronic-hardware/

I contacted them, and they offered to send me a couple samples of the smallest piezo film and piezo cable, for experimentation purposes.

I exchanged a few emails with Emmett, and he graciously offered to send me a set of saddle screws and a couple of slide blocks for experimentation with the aforementioned piezo samples.

Now, it's back to the waiting game until said materials arrive and experimentation can begin... [insert mad scientist laugh] :ugeek:

This is beyond exciting!!!

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Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:36 pm
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Post Re: Ghost MIDI pickup
Mad scientist laugh indeed! Can I be Igor? This is awesome that you assembled the groundwork for what could be a breakthrough in stick midification. Keep us posted!

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Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:50 am
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