OK, so I got the concept of a pre-amp being needed to match the impedance of the stick - either sepparate or built into the amp. So I've been looking for amps with instrument inputs (that I can afford) or at getting a couple of pre-amps.

But recently someone suggested I just get a DI-box to convert the Hi-Z from the stick to a ballanced XLR Lo-Z signal, and plug that into a mixer and from there into a powered speaker... This seems like a more cost effective solution. Not believing in a free lunch, what is the down side?

Thanks

Well, I'm no technical whiz, but if you like the natural stick sound, then DI boxes might be the way to go, especially if you can add a bit of reverb through your board. I don't have a ton of experience with using DIs for stick but my old Bass Driver sounds pretty badass on the bass side.

I like and use a Line 6 POD for the versatility, but my hope is to eventually pare down to just the effects I use and need so to not put my signal through a bunch of needless digital processing. However, there are some very affordable multi-effects boards and modelling amps that give great 'bang for buck' because you get things like built it tuners, compression and reverb.

I would suggest going with the later, if you are unsure of what direction you wish to go with the instrument, because it gives you more tools to work with.

This might be what Alan refers to, so I'll piggyback on. I currently run just two pedals and a mixer, a Mackie VLZ4 (inputs not in instrument mode, though they could be).

Bass: Stick --> Zoom MS-60B --> Mixer (Mackie VLZ4) --> Amp
Melody: Stick --> Zoom MS-50G --> Mixer --> Amp.

The Zoom Multi-FX pedals are effectively playing the role of DI for their respective sides of the instrument. They're 1Mohm input impedance.

The thing I like most about this setup is that it's compact, and didn't bust the budget. But let me ask: am I losing something with this signal path?

I think in most situations you will benefit from a preamp or DI, unless whatever you are plugging into has a high-impedance input (and quality preamp, of course).

there are probably a million different types of preamps out there...

among others I have used, I really like the Presonus Bluetube, since it has actuals tubes in the signal path which can allow you to dial in a really nice, warm tone (even with a very subtle level of distortion when cranked up)..plus it's two channels with independent controls and a 1K ohm input (sorry cant find the upside down horseshoe symbol for "ohm"!).

It's small - about the footprint of a Kindle reader - thicker of course - and I use it for acoustic guitar as well:

http://www.presonus.com/products/BlueTu ... /techspecs



That can go for as cheap as $125

Thanks man, I'll check that out.

Do you use this as a pre- into something else, or directly into your speakers?

It's looking more and more to me that their really isn't an answer to the question of "the right" setup. The choice of processing boils down to something in a spectrum between two extremes.

One one end of the spectrum, you just have the stick plugged directly into an amp that does everything you want done to signal and puts out a sound you like - simplicity itself. The problem is finding that perfect amp, which may or may not exist, and will definitely be expensive.

This leads to the other end of the spectrum, which is building exactly the signal path you want by buying components and stringing them together to get the sound you want.

The problem for guys like me who have never played and electric instrument is that we a) don't really know the sound we want, and b) don't even know what the options are. So we start down one path, hear something new and realize we didn't even consider that option. Throw into the mix that the starting cost is quite high, and it can become overwhelming

I think I'm going to go with the simple option to start and get a Fishman loudbox, and focus on learning to play. I'm told it can do a lot out of the box. If I start to bounce into limitations, I'll at east be able to describe what it is I want to do, and someone can tell me how to do it.

Hi
My usual arrangement is a DI for each side of the stick , from these I go straight to the mic preamps of the mixer , its a clean easy arrangement and from there to the PA , powered monitor or whatever it happens to be.

Mostly I have a couple of boss pedals before the DI.
Usually I have the two Radial DI's in the Picture , there are great , not the cheapest but I'll never need to upgrade from them and can pass them down to kids!
Also in the shot is the little Behringer DI20, cheap but pretty handy sometimes for simplicity. It also has a link mode for two in, one out so both sides of the stick can be merged to one XLR output, not ideal maybe but can be useful, like on my busking amp with only one XLR in for example.

Mostly I use the Radials at Open Mics etc, clean & pure , they are well know for their quality ( thanks Canada ). They help bring the Instrument to life I think from what I have experienced so far. The J48 requires Phantom Power off the desk, the JDI is passive complete with the famous Jensen Audio transformer inside. Its always on the bass side. Cheers , B

Into whatever amp I was using - or the AD converter if I was recording.
probably a bit of overkill since some of the amps/recorders had pretty decent preamps already - but the tube tone of the Presonus really does add some nice flavor to the sound.

To address your other question about "The problem for guys like me who have never played and electric instrument is that we a) don't really know the sound we want, "..well, just start cheap and try out some things. If you are happy with your sound, you're done!

Or - take your instrument to a store where you can test boxes and whatnot. Most places, even Guitar Center, will let you do that. Most people there have probably never seen/played a Stick and usually will be very helpful and intrigued. They always were when I did that.

You got options that don't involve any costly mistakes...just get out there and try them!

I was/still-am new to all the electric func of the stick and electric guitar domain.

I bought a Zed-10fx http://www.allen-heath.com/ahproducts/zed-10fx/
which I was hoping would serve as a DI-box/preamp. And reviews of the box (generally from the guitar community) said it did a great job bringing up the signal level.

I mostly play using the XLR cables so I can get the current to my Railboard pickups and put them in "active" mode.

However I find that the signal coming out of the Zed10 isn't as strong as I'd like.

• When playing out the headphone jack, I have turn up the input gains and headphone volume enough that I can hear some background hiss.
• When playing out the monitor out to my general purpose stereo receiver (something I tried recently when without my PA box), the receiver definitely thinks the input is weak and I have to turn the volume way up to hear it at all.

No doubt all these misconceptions were mine, but in the end having just the Zed10fx
has not met my signal amplification needs. I don't remember if I hear a hiss when hooked up to my PA and don't have it here with me to test.

I also don't have the cables handy to see if the TRS jack would be amplified better with a passive pickup. I know that TRS cables on my PA inputs are definitely processed differently (better) than the XLR cables. So the PA was clearly expecting to have to do more amplification work with the TRS inputs than with the mic inputs.

(PA is a Behringer Europort MPA something or other, very satisfied practice amp purchase I've plugged elsewhere).

Anyway, for my own edification, should the Zed10fx have been all I needed for preamps? Or should I expect that I still need a DI box between the stick and Zed10, or a preamp between the Zed10 and other receivers?

At this point I don't spend any time thinking about it, my playing is bad enough I have my work cut out for me without worrying about hiss, volume, or other things.

I do notice that the sound of the stick is quite different in all three of the ways I listen to it.
My headphones, general stereo, and Behringer PA all make the sound pretty much completely different. Every nuance like fingers against the strings, degree to which vibrato is evident, etc. That always surprises me (the differences).

Doc, I really think that you've hit on a good strategy for yourself--and for me! I bought a small Fishman to start with last Christmas (started playing Stick in August) and have been very happy with it. I'm now ready to start thinking about moving up to a bigger one (maybe by next Christmas).

The Fishman amp (I got the Loudbox Mini) has been sufficient all by itself--not counting several gazillion dollars worth of software effects, plugins, and stuff for Pro Tools, but that's for recording. The Fishman alone gets me rocking with or for other people in small settings, and for practicing around the house. (And the kids steal it for an e-drum monitor, too!)

But for playing without an amp at all, or running direct into a speaker set, the $39 Irig 2 is pretty handy.

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/iRig2

Since you're already sold on it, get the Fishman and you're good to go for a while, until you start getting that urge for something bigger! Best of luck on the playing but you won't need it on the Fishman! (I sound like a sponsor! )

Thanks for the encouragement, and for mentioning that you use the mini. I was wondering which one to get... I think Rob Martino is using the performe version - sounds great but out of my price range, so I was considering the artist. Will take a look a the mini too.