When I first joined this site, I had in mind that I could save some money by getting an SG12 instead of a Grand Stick. I posted a thread based on my thoughts at the time, and I am now revisiting the concept of the SG12 with a different thought process entirely.

Essentially, the concept is to have a Stick Guitar which covers both electric guitar and electric bass in terms of range. Specifically, I am imagining a bass side which begins at an electric bass's fifth string (counting the way extended range electric bass strings are counted) and rises in fifths from there. The melody side, however, would start with an electric guitar's first string and descend in fourths from there.

How do you think this tuning would work compared to a more standard Stick tuning, in terms of how the two hands interact?

Melody

1. E (open guitar high E)
2. B down a 4th
3. F# down a 4th
4. C# down a 4th
5. G# down a 4th
6. D# down a 4th
   
   Bass
7. B
8. F# up a 5th
9. C# up a 5th
10. G# up a 5th
11. D# up a 5th
12. D# up a 5th

Unfortunately, the short-scale Stick will not accommodate the low B string very well. It will sound like a big "clank", or "gank" or "gonk", not like a bass. For a string to vibrate at that frequency with the appropriate tension for tapping, you need a longer scale.

Also, the short scale Stick can go much higher than guitar high E (a 4th higher, to be exact). So maybe that would be good for what you wan to do.

What I'd suggest is that you abandon the concept of having the familiar pitches you desire at the X fret in any case. If those are notes you will want to use a lot, then it makes more sense to put them at a higher fret position, anyway, especially if you plan to play in the normal "crossed" way.

Just chewing the idea around with you. The SG12 is really much better suited to a rhythm+melody instrument than a bass+melody instrument. I use a log G on mine, and it's bassy enough relative to the melody side, though it really wouldn't be bassy enough to be the bass instrument in an ensemble sense playing traditional rock repertoire.

The very last note of this piece is that G, which is the G below guitar low E:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvYYVCBn1Lk[/youtube]

I play both and they are totally differently resonating planks! The SG12 vibrates like a guitar and is very light on the touch. A Grand can be as lightly set up (easy expressive playing) but it won't have the same guitar-like vibe because of the longer strings. But I think the Grand has other goodies, like a certain "tone density" that the SG12 just doesn't care about. This is not just my own subjective feelings for the two instruments because I'm finding the these characteristics very present when recording them.

When experimenting with tuning and string density it seems to me as the SE default setup is optimal (Medium MR). I play Heavy MR now on the Grand but for tone matters I'm planning to go back to Medium. I think the Grand with Heavy strings suffers a bit from the "clunk phenomenon" Greg mentioned when I play thick bass strings at a high fret position.

I see the same thing happen in my guitars when applying too thick strings. The just turn lame and lifeless. YOu need the appropriate scale length to get down in pitch.

Thanks for your insight, guys. I will bear your advice in mind as I reexamine the SE price list with a few new ideas which I am still developing.

FWIW, here's where I ended up tuning wise as I thought about the same "I want to cover the range of an electric bass and a guitar at the same time" kind of approach.

I tend to play the melody side between frets 8 or 9 up to fret 17 (and higher on the upper strings). Obviously the center point of this is around fret 12. I use the MR melody side tuning, which gives a familiar "mental anchor" of B,E,A,D,G,C on the melody side at the 12th fret (I've been a guitarist for a zillion years).

For the bass side, I tune what would be normal MR tuning up one whole step. That gives me a bass guitar Low E at the 2nd fret of the 7th string and on up from there. Most of the time, I tend to play the root of the chord in my left hand on the 7th and 8th strings, with some (but a lesser amount) rooted on the 9th string. I found that raising the bass side one whole step gave me a little more space between my hands and allowed me to play at lower frets on the melody side where (to Greg and Per's point on the "klunk factor"), the melody side sounds sweeter to my ear.

Totally agree that you should be thinking about a 12 String Grand to get the sound of both. Also, I use light guage stings. Have been playing this tuning for a couple of years now, and am very pleased.

Again, just FWIW.

Karma

Very interesting stuff, Karma. For my purposes, saving $300 on an SG12 is false economy. The Grand Stick seems to be the chameleon of the Stick family: supporting myriad tunings, convertible to a Ten String Grand, and allowing for very different kinds of arrangements just due to the extra strings.

It looks like I will just hold out for a used Grand, rather than saving some money on an SG12.

Seems like a good strategy! I enjoy the extended range every time I pick up my Grand but it can't sound like my SG-12. But then my SG-12 can't sound like my Grand. In the long run the way to stay sane is to get both, but a Grand is probably a better starting point... if you are not particularly going for the SG-12 sound.