Hello gang!

Decades ago I was a good musician on clarinet, bass clarinet, contrabass clarinet, and trumpet. I loved making music then, but haven't done it since. I have really missed it... it's like a part of my soul has been missing for the last 35 years.

In the 80's I first fell in love with the sound of the Stick listening to Tony Levin in King Crimson. From there I listened to what he'd done with other bands, and what other Stick players were doing. Since then, I've always fantasized about playing Stick, but never pursued it at all.

At this point in my life I have more discretionary income than in the past and I want to try following my dreams. I want make music again, dang it! I've never played a stringed instrument or any instrument that plays chords, but I desperately want to. I want to do it before I'm too old and arthritic for it. I've been doing some research and I'm leaning toward a Railboard.

I'm coming at this from a point of near-complete ignorance and I have some very fundamental questions. I beg you to indulge me:

1. I have some friends who play guitar and they tell me I'm crazy for spending "that kind of money" for a Stick. They say I should get a cheap guitar see how I like it before I "dive in". However, my dream is to play tap-style. My gut feeling is that learning guitar would be counter-productive to learning Stick afterward. Am I right about that?

2a. I have read that Stick is very hard to learn. I've also read that Stick is "not as hard as it seems" to learn. (and by that I mean Stick or Stick-like instruments in general) Which is it? What I've read has always been comments by guitar players. Would Stick be easier to learn for people who didn't play guitar first? I know Greg Howard came at the stick from a keyboard, and he did OK. How hard is it compared to a woodwind or brass instrument?

2b. I don't know anybody who owns or plays Stick, and as far as I can determine there are no instructors around here (Indianapolis). I will primarily be learning from books, videos, experimentation, and perhaps the occasional Skype lesson with an instructor far away. Is that a reasonable expectation/goal for a beginner?

3. Will I need two amplifiers? IE one for the bass side and another for the melody side? Are there practice amps that could take both bass and melody inputs? (I may never need anything more than a practice amp. I may never play for anybody's benefit but my own.)

4a. In my research I found Krappy Guitars, and I see they make some relatively inexpensive tap-style instruments. I haven't found any instructional material that's specific to Krappy guitars. If I save money by buying a Krappy, could I learn to play it using Stick books and videos?

4b. Will a Krappy guitar take the same tunings as a Stick? If not, I assume learning material would have to be transposed before it was useful. That would be an added complication.

4c. Krappy Guitars say that they won't offer any tech support or help you set it up or anything like that. Are they serious about that? (I assume they are.) That could be a problem for me, and it makes me lean back toward a Railboard just for the support - at least 3rd party support like this forum.

5. On the Railboard order form it asks what gauge strings you want. How can I know what's best for me to start with? Should just start with Medium?

About a month ago I mentioned this to my wife in passing and now she's practically begging me to do it. She knows how I feel... she's seen me cry at a concert because I so wished I could do something like that. I can't say money is no object, but I have the boss's permission to spend some.

There's probably more I could say/ask, but that's more than enough for now.

If you have any advice, encouragement, or tough love to give I want to hear it. Thank you very much for your time!

1) Buy a used Stick from Stick Enterprises. That way you get value and a professionally set up instrument. Guitar and Stick have very little in common.

2a) All instruments are difficult to learn to play well. Stick has some interesting challenges that you have to work through. Study and practice help.

2b) There are good instructional material available. Check stick.com. There are also some very fine teachers who will work with you over Skype.

3) No. Depending on the model pickup you get, you can switch it to mono. If you amp has 2 channels, you can use those.

4) don't know anything about this

5) Best to ask Stick Enterprises for any particular set up issues. They know.


Good luck with your decision.

You recommend a used Stick over a new Railboard?

Your remarks indicate you are considering a Krappy due to financial considerations. Buying a used Stick instead of a new Railboard is an option that would save you several hundred dollars.

Hey welcome! This instrument and this community is awesome and I think you've come to the right place for answers!



I'm going to disagree with carvingcode here. The guitar/bass/mandolin/banjo all have their basic musical language in common, the language of fretted string instruments. The Stick draws from all of these instruments and more (I wrote an essay about it here: https://www.facebook.com/taptheory/posts/1046568892148177) and having come from a background in guitar and bass, I've noticed that while many of the techniques and concepts don't translate immediately, they DO translate as you move past a beginner level.

However, it would take a few years of experience on guitar or bass to begin to recognize the translation to the Stick, and if you're new to either one and you're ready to dive into the Stick, then you might as well!



I'm in the camp of "it's not any harder than any other instrument." I teach Stick online and face to face, and I think much of the difficulty of the instrument comes from the amount of unexplored territory. 60 years ago, tapping on the guitar neck was a new and mysterious technique. Now, as guitar has progressed, it's standard fare for many instrumentalists, with videos, books and DVDs abound on the subject. Having someone help you open up doors on the instrument will make the learning process much more condensed and less like trial and error.



There are many videos you can find on YouTube, books available on Stick.com or Amazon and many teachers that would be happy to teach you through Skype. I also run a subscription based online school that lets you subscribe to access for the supplemental exercises and transcriptions of my instructional videos and arrangements. You can find it at http://www.patreon.com/jgoldbergmusic



It depends on what you want to do with the instrument! For my 2-Stick and drums metal band, I use a guitar amp and a bass amp with separate FX paths. My bandmate, Stickist John Tyler Kent, routes everything into an FX unit and then has it come out stereo into a high quality PA speaker. When I practice at home, I practice out of a bass amp with two inputs and when I play small solo sets, I'm coming out of a single Roland Cube.

In many ways it's still the Wild West for this instrument, so if you can find a sound that works for your budget and makes you happy, then that's the right answer.



I suppose you could. My bandmate got a Krappy, and he had it tuned to MR like a Stick. He says it's definitely not the same and there's still some work he has to put into it. There's no replacing the real thing and for quality tapguitars, the Stick is where it's at for the price. Carvingcode suggested getting a used instrument refurbished from Stick Enterprises and I agree that's the way to go if you're trying to save some money.



Krappy is, as far as I know, all custom orders. My bandmate got one in MR tuning, so yep.



I wouldn't know but if that's what he's saying I'd take his word for it.



I'd say start with medium and see how you like it. I started with medium and wound up going to a mix gauge set to try and balance out the "weight" across the strings. Lately I've been playing with the idea of just going back to medium or heavy. I'm not sure yet. This is definitely more of a comfort and personal preference thing than a "right answer" thing.

Hope that helps and good luck!

I'm a fellow newbie who has had one of these things for about half a year and a really limited amount of time to work with it even then. Nevertheless, here are some of my thoughts, trying to stay in areas where I might be at least minimally informed:

1. I've played guitar for a long time (although I will not claim well). If you want to play the Stick, I'd just play the Stick. Why spend your time learning something tangentially related to the Stick instead of just learning the Stick? Sure, I think there is some carryover, but I doubt it is as helpful as working with the instrument that you actually want to play. This perhaps presupposes that you're the type who'll stay with it, but your background on a lot of other stuff suggests this is the case. Also referencing 2a), it's the hardest to learn the Stick if you don't have a Stick. So when I was sure I wanted one and had obtained the money to get one, I did, even knowing that my time now would be limited.

3. I just use one at present - you can either use mono mode or you can direct the sides into a mixer or other device that allows mixing and then run a mono signal from that. At some point I may experiment a bit more, but that is good enough for me now. I wouldn't worry too much about this at the start.

5. Lacking any real, experiential information, I started with medium (on a Railboard). It's fine for me, but YMMV. It seems like a reasonable starting point to me.

The comparison between
http://www.krappyguitars.com/touchstyle.html
and
http://stick.com/instruments/railboard/
is an easy one.

I choose the Railboard, as the hands down winner.
The Stick Enterprises products hold their value over time.

Thank you all so much for the input! I really appreciate it.

... ...a guitar with the same quality of a stick is at least three times the money of a stick, do you know...



...ok, what are you waiting for, just go for the stick, it's designed for tap-style as nothing else...

...and don't forget, we're all crazy here, ....

I will agree with you on this one. My PRS Custom 24 was $3500.