This thread is becoming one of the best stick sources ever. It should definitely be made sticky or converted into an article

Hi Ian, you seem to want to wind things down so here are some last points.


That would certainly be the best way to convince people, with sound and motion.



I don't think I'm giving up anything as far as "consistency" goes, quite the opposite. I've always said that developing consistent technique is the key to growing as a player. So that feels a little like you're putting words in my mouth.

The "optimum note" concept is your language ("right note" I believe you called it). I don't agree with it in this case, I was just trying to describe the trade-off in your terms (to be fair). In general, I prefer the sound of the melody strings higher up than the 7th fret. They sound more "lyrical" to my ear as the vibrating length gets shorter, especially the thinner strings.

So it's no sacrifice for me not to play below the 7th fret or so on the melody strings. None at all.



Not at all. Less actually. Because the hand is closer to the center of the body the arm and shoulder are already more relaxed which makes the motion easier and less severe (this really does all depend on good instrument positioning, though. The whole package at work again).

Looking forward to seeing and hearing some playing from you that demonstrates what you're claiming. I think it would help me understand where you're coming from better than anything any of us could write.

For everyone else.
Please remember: since we don't have a separate articulating hand to play the notes, we have to do it all with our fretting hand, so...it's not just about "the chord" its about how many different ways you can play the chord.

Hi Greg,

I'm still deeply interested in the dialogue - it's just that a few hours ago a client decided that they wanted their project to go live next Monday (and we thought it would be in a few weeks), and that mean's I'll be working all hours to complete that and the other urgent work already due for the following Thursday. So basically just life (and I'm grateful to be working at all at the moment).

I would like to contribute more thoughts/pictures/videos/whatever at some point but I'll have to take a bit of a breather for the time being...

Cheers,

Ian

Looking forward to it, Ian. I hope we haven't turned a discussion into a dialogue between the two of us.

And to everyone else. No tuning is "perfect" let's help each other get the most out of what we've decided to do.

Conceptual things are always fun to discuss, but I'd rather focus on practicalities, as I think that's where real problems arise, when we put the theory into practice.

I guess I would just clarify that in my experience 4ths and 5ths both offer a wide variety of bass and chord accompaniment, they are more like different languages with their own particular sounds. I've never really felt I'm that limited in terms of possibilities or pitch range, although admittedly I'm not going for a wide cross section of musical genres. When writing tunes and developing arrangements I'm continually discovering neat little things that are possible.

Here is a quicktime video I just put together of some left hand only accompaniment patterns. I think a lot of the overall sound is inherent to 4ths - being able to play triads in the bass while holding other tones, accessing passing tones in both the bass and guitar register, major 2nd in the voicing, etc. The last section also makes use of the melody side and the root-5-octave "power chord" possible on the low bass string and two low melody strings. I apologize that they are a bit rough, the best I could do in a short time this morning.

http://wavearts.com/Rob/movies/RobLH4ths.mov

(I felt it was a little rough for YouTube, hopefully people don't have problems opening it)

Just a note for everyone, these videos will require QuickTime to be installed on your computer. The sound is fabulous compared to what YouTube would do to them. I would always prefer this over YT!

-Eric

Hi Rob,

That's a great video. More like that and you will entice me back to try it again... I really like the extension of the left hand over the melody strings, very powerful.

I see your technique and understanding of your tuning deepening and broadening all the time. I'll have to work on a companion video that shows similar kinds of things in inverted 5ths by themselves

The main differences I see between how your tuning works and the inverted 5ths is that you are usually playing the root with the middle finger, whereas on the inverted 5ths its the 1st or 3rd finger. Maybe yours offers more possibilities for playing "around" the bass note, where the inverted 5ths makes it possible to reach farther away from the bass note. The pull-offs to the first finger are brilliant. I'll amend my list.

Thanks for expanding my understanding of your tuning and its possibilities.

bravo!

Just when you thought this thread was dead...

I'm sure I'll live to regret this but I thought I'd have a go at recording something as promised. The quality (recording and playing) is not great but at least it may give the gist. Apologies also for the vocals, but it's a bit empty without them...

Anyway I've tried to do something that demonstrates playing near the nut with the left hand - 0th fret in fact!! There's also a bit of reaching across with the right hand for the "bass solo", although on reflection I suppose you may have been more interested in seeing the left hand crossing over - next time maybe!

Anyway please be gentle with me as it's my first attempt!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8fcOfs4dM4

Ian

Hey Ian...there's not enough going on for me...perhaps fit some knife juggling in next time

Very impressive stuff. I remember you playing this last year...and being surprised to hear little lead twiddles creeping in amongst the bass/comping/singing. Value for money!

Hi Ian,

Thanks for doing this. You're giving folks a good idea of how it works for you, and where you're coming from. Cheers!

For reference, the 0th fret is called the X fret.

I guess my question to you would be, in the context of this thread: "what is it about your approach to this tune that you feel is unique to your tuning?"

Would you be willing to post what the chords are? as it all goes by pretty quick. I'd like to try to work something out to post in the Classic tuning for comparison's sake.

Those minor 7th chords make things easy in 5ths. I'd love to see you post something that involved more major chords or dominant 7th chords in the left hand..... if you have the time.

Anyway, it's cool to see 5ths in that direction, too. thanks.