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 Cheap thrills 
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Post Cheap thrills
Yeah, we had another ant attack in the kitchen this morning, ruining our coffee break. This time they got the dog food, nicely prepared by Yuta with Buckley waiting, now crawling with ants. It seems they've found a centralized base in the framework of our stove and came calling this morning for breakfast.

And now my day is crawling with words, words meant to eat up the leadership, tear down the membership, of a genuine cultural community of common interest or passion for The Stick, its musical potential and its string tapping method (which I call "Free Hands").

At a time when PC sensitivity has saturated our national culture and designated groups are protected against hurtful speech (speech that can also lead to harmful acts), we have in the process sacrificed some real First Amendment freedoms of expression for the good of those selected groups.

But what about all the other groups? Our group? Many become what I call "free targets" for venting suppressed rage. We laugh with nervous tolerance about PC as our rights of free speech are progressively hemmed in. Then a new on-line phenomenon emerges, that of pent up and reactive anger. It must feel good to target the successful work of a group and its leaders, to step into the forum of a living cultural entity and try to insult, expose and tear them down - cheap thrills, I say!

LSZ - Emmett, you've clearly taken my post as a personal attack on you, SE, and everything you've acheived. I assure you that's not the case.
EC - I'm not assured.

LSZ - I've always been LoopStationZebra on this forum, and have never purposely hidden my identity, as your comment suggests. Totally class-less on your part to suggest otherwise.
EC - More insults, and hidden identity wasn't on my mind.

LSZ - I also didn't attack you personally; though you seem to take any voice of dissent as such.
EC - Now you're casting me as some sort of a petty tyrant because I've taken specific objection to your crude attacks.

LSZ - You're posting that I sold it on Ebay suggests some nefarious or backhanded behaviour on my part, and I utterly resent that. Again, class-less.

EC - False offense! I don't know how you could read that from my words. We see ebay Stick sales all the time and even refer prospective Stick buyers and sellers there.

LSZ - Hoping for acknowledgement and credit from a competitor is a futile waste of time and energy. At the end of the day it does little more than serve one's ego. I've been there with my own product design history. I know.

EC - I'd like to steer away from competition of musical instrument products and to focus on the cultural and musical aspects of my contributions since 1969. Musicians are taught by other musicians, or at least influenced by them - an artistic and cultural line of succession where mentors are acknowledged and sometimes even honored. In my case that line has been intentionally broken by the "touchstyle" advocates who minimize my creative work and have tried for 15 years to disparage me personally and professionally.

LSZ - Of course it's a knockoff. But again, there's little or nothing you or fanboys on this forum can do about it. Well, bitching about it certainly helps one feel better, I suppose. :roll:
EC - No comment needed here.

LSZ - You're dead wrong. Manufacturers large and small have realized that a.) Unless the knockoff is EXACT (purely in terms of aesthetics), they are going to spend a ton of money on legal proceedings and most likely LOSE. see: Gibson b.) Endless market studies/tests have clearly shown that knockoff production has benefited manufacturers; oftentimes giving them exposure that they might not have gotten otherwise.

EC - In this market niche, such exposure works in the other direction. Our long time competitors benefit from our image and our public and customer good will by identifying with us every which way (except the most natural way). From the beginning they've tried to take over our Stick groups, forums, activities, and venues world wide, then create ill will toward us and our instruments in order to sell their own.

LSZ - My beef here is with fanboys who have demonstrated they have little or no tolerance for other tap instruments; nevermind Traktor's stuff. I submit, in fact, that even if Traktor didn't practice slimy and bizarre marketing techniques that he would STILL be despised. :lol:

EC - Your expression "fanboys", though colorful, sounds a little sick, but I may be wrong.

LSZ - It's given on album and CD sleeves with CHAPMAN Stick listed as the instrument. And it's given by me. I've gigged out quite a few times now with my Stick, and have taken it around to numerous music shops on a regular basis. So many people were asking me about the Stick that, I kid you not, I printed out little pieces of paper with the Stick.com address that I keep in my gig bag. :lol:

EC - I have to say that I do appreciate that. Such performer interaction with an audience seems to flow naturally and I remember it well in my earlier days. It's admittedly a pain to keep answering the same questions and each artist has his own creative way to deal with that. Vance Gloster had a T-shirt printed with FAQs (and answers) top to bottom.

LSZ - I knew full well that my post would piss off the cult-like Acolytes, and that I probably won't be welcome at any upcoming Stick gatherings. :P Because if there's one thing I've noticed here is that dissent is heavily frowned upon. No matter. I said what I felt needed to be said.

EC - I have a problem with your religious reference (Acolytes). All we need is to be branded as a cult, then comes the compound, then comes the pounding. Dissent, though negative, is often constructive, and often for us too, but not your brand of psychodrama.

LSZ - I just hope that I'll still be able to get a set of strings or a new case from SE when I need them....... :?:
EC - Yes, let's hope that's still possible.

All the Best, Emmett.


Mon Aug 23, 2010 6:59 pm
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
BSharp wrote:
LSZ - I just hope that I'll still be able to get a set of strings or a new case from SE when I need them....... :?:
EC - Yes, let's hope that's still possible.

All the Best, Emmett.


C'mon Emmett. Are you really going to deny him materials he needs to play the Stick? If so, that's just really sad.

I'm having a hard time believing you're this thin skinned. I reread his initial post several times and I don't see how you can interpret it as a personal attack at you. He was venting his frustration at the general attitude and tone of this "living cultural entity" as you put it, which yes, routinely reaches ridiculous levels. I know you're at the center of this community because you started it all but I know even you aren't that tied into the fabric of this forum that you can't see the distinction. The seperation. If you can't, well sorry, but it is about your ego.

I also find it interesting that you commented that in his second post..."refuting me with reasonable, almost professional tones" when I found it much more agressive toward you personally.

EC - "I'd like to steer away from competition of musical instrument products and to focus on the cultural and musical aspects of my contributions since 1969.".... I'm not sure I buy it. Which is fine. Nothing wrong with being a strong businessman. Hell, I think you've been pretty civil with Traktor and all the others. If I was in your position I'd have made it my life's work to bury them all. Sue them into the stone age. But that's me. To each his own.

Loopstationzebra's posts and point of view are good for this forum. And I hope he continues. As for the language he used, guys, get over it. You're not that fragile. And you have just as much a right to post your views on it as he did.

Tritone


Mon Aug 23, 2010 9:01 pm
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
Hm...I am member of this Forum. I play the Chapman Stick, use the Standart Tuning, play crossed, utilise the Free Hands method. All invented by Emmett Chapman.

I do this as a man with a free will. Freedom of choice is mine. Nobody forced me too. Only the superior quality of the Chapman Stick, its features and the possiblitys it offers and the service at Stick Enterprises made me decide.

Does that make me a brainless "fanboy", a "cult like acolyte" following dogmas of Emmett Chapman (He didn't make) without questions, without critic?

Does that make the Chapman Stick community a sect?

Certainly not!

Statements like ""cult like acolyte" show a weak mind.

Peace!

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"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler" AlbertEinstein


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Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:04 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
tritone wrote:

C'mon Emmett. Are you really going to deny him materials he needs to play the Stick? If so, that's just really sad.

I'm having a hard time believing you're this thin skinned.



I suppose that standing in judgment of a customer's "worthiness" and denying the orders of those deemed unworthy would provide a cheap thrill, too…but I'm sure that this never happens.


Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:30 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
tritone wrote:
Hell, I think you've been pretty civil with Traktor and all the others. If I was in your position I'd have made it my life's work to bury them all. Sue them into the stone age. But that's me. To each his own.

Loopstationzebra's posts and point of view are good for this forum. And I hope he continues. As for the language he used, guys, get over it. You're not that fragile. And you have just as much a right to post your views on it as he did.

Tritone
I've noticed that the only time you (and Tetrachord) participate here is when there's a fight going on. Sorry the forum isn't interesting to you at other times. At least now we know why you're here (cheap thrills, indeed).

There are those brief glimmers of hope when perpetually anonymous posters have something illuminative to contribute. As you point out, Emmett's actually pretty forgiving, and willing to move on when a fight is over.

I think the language issue is a real one, however. People are less inclined to take you seriously when your posts are full of expletives. So if you want to make a point there are better ways to do it. Swearing in public is just another cheap thrill.

Thanks, Manny, for keeping stickist.com an open place for real discussion, and for not censoring the forum (except for the ovbious Teflon spam, of course).

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Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:57 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
More than anything, I think it was LSZs tone and attitude that set this volcano off. I don't understand people that have to talk this way in order to make a point. The expletives don't bother me, but the unfounded aggression does. Some people (usually the a**holes) like to call it being "up front" or a "straight shooter". Nope, it's called being a friggin' jerk. I simply have no use for people like this, and the world would be a far better place with less of them wasting air. Well, at least Tritone found someone to share his Saturday nights with :D .

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Last edited by heartstrings on Tue Aug 24, 2010 6:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

Tue Aug 24, 2010 6:04 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
I'm currently groggy on painkillers, let's see how this goes....

Cheap Thrills - to me this title highlights the way in which communication through email/forums etc, can degrade very quickly. It's important to be very considered with ones response.

Having said that let me be Frank but not Zappa, ok that was bad a joke. It's obvious to me that the new TT instruments are cheap in appearance and attitude. You only have to look at the thing to know that, sorry, and yes I did check it out further.

HOWEVER. We all know by now that the more tapping instruments we have out there, the more visible our world becomes to the global community. Diversity is good thing in this respect.

Emmett's contribution will always be the foundation stone. The music is now being shared with all these instruments and the art form is evolving in an amazing way. Free Hands techniques are still being under utilized. There are still so many ways to play these multi stringed instruments.


Tue Aug 24, 2010 6:17 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
[/quote]I've noticed that the only time you (and Tetrachord) participate here is when there's a fight going on...[/quote]

Yes Greg, this is quite interesting to observe, even though it is not surprising to me.

I have a question to everyone in the forum: Why is it, that most user of any forum I know, use pseudonym names instead of their real name? When those members use strong language, accuse and attack fellow human beings, to "bring their point across", it feels to me like they are hiding behind a bush and throwing stones and dirt at the others instead of making themselves visible for everyone and stand for their opinion. You know what I mean...It looks to me, they are afraid, that their bad behaviour and harsh opinions might have consequences, still pretending how tuff they are. But they are not tuff enough to connect their opinion to their real name. Even Emmett, Steve Adelson have a pseudonyms, but they sign their messages and stand for their opinion, by making making themselfs visible within the forum.

I respect the Freedom of Speech and the Right of Anonymity - But I just can't stand snipers that are only in it for the "Cheap Thrill" without risking their reputation.

What do you think?

Tap in Peace, what ever you tap on.

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Michael Paffen

"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler" AlbertEinstein


10 String Rosewood (Stickup)
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Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:03 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
Pseudonyms are not only common on the net, they are the rule rather than the exception. Preservation of anonymity is essential if we are to preserve the free nature of the internet. That's why people do it. Doesn't matter what their identity is, only the content of the message.

There are forces trying to change this... not a good thing...

K

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Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:23 am
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Post Re: Cheap thrills
K Rex wrote:
Pseudonyms are not only common on the net, they are the rule rather than the exception. Preservation of anonymity is essential if we are to preserve the free nature of the internet. That's why people do it. Doesn't matter what their identity is, only the content of the message.

There are forces trying to change this... not a good thing...

K


Yeah, I see what you mean and I basicly agree. I love the free nature of the internet aswell. Maybe tolarating people that are abusing this freedom is the price to be paid in order to preserve the internets freedom. Then again, maybe this kind of Freedom gets very expensive from time to time,...Not a good thing either right?

Thanx, for your comment. Any more opinions? Maybe in relationship to freedom in business, trademarks and copyrights.

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Michael Paffen

"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler" AlbertEinstein


10 String Rosewood (Stickup)
12 String Rosewood (PASV-4)
Classic Tuning (Medium Gauge)
2 Avalon U5
2 DBX 160A
Lexicon MPX1


Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:40 am
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